Skip to main content
12:00 pm
are his most enthusiastic supporters expecting the looeea? >> and it's the moment we have all been waiting for. a liberal makes the case for guns. oh, shoot, "the cycle" is firing on all cylinders today. details are still being hammered out but we're told a cease-fire to temporarily halt the seven-day conflict in gaza is in the works. more than 130 people have been killed. this was the scene over gaza a short while ago. you can see and hear the rockets. the israeli military dropped leaflets over gaza warning civilians to get out ahead of a final blitz. the hamas loud speakers told them to stay put. israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu who faces re-election in two months said hamas is hiding behind civilians. >> they're deliberately and
12:01 pm
indiscriminately targeting our civilians and they deliberately hide behind their civilians. the terrorists targets are children and they use their own children as human shields. but if stronger military action proves necessary to stop the barrage of rockets, israel will not hesitate to do what is necessary to defend our people. >> secretary of state hillary clinton is heading to jerusalem to help secure a truce before israel launches a ground invasion. u.n. secretary-general ban ki moon is also there and nine arab leaders are showing solidarity with the palestinians. a big change since the last serious fighting four years ago. earlier today at the u.n., the united states blocked a joint statement condemning the conflict because it didn't mention the root cause which the u.s. says is hamas missile attacks. nbc's martin fletcher is in tel aviv and martin, if there's a
12:02 pm
talk of cease-fire, what is israel doing dropping leaflets? >> reporter: that's a good question. israel actually -- it has not said that the cease-fire is as far advanced as the arabs have. israel is insisting on a long-term solution and they haven't got that yet. so what they're doing is still preparing their way for a possible ground invasion if these talks of a truce fall through. so israel's army is still poised to invade and they have dropped leaflets in certain areas of gaza, eltelling people to stay away from certain roads, particularly in the north, where the israeli army has gone in first when they invaded. i guess part of the strategy which they have been doing all week, before shelling areas in which there are civilians in order to get a specific target. they have either dropped leaflets or fired low explosion
12:03 pm
shells to warn people away. really it's pressure on the hamas to reach an agreement for a truce. otherwise, the leaflets warn a ground invasion is still very much an option. >> okay. nbc's martin fletcher, stay safe. bobby, i want to bring you in. yesterday, a former military officer reminded me of the quote palestinians never waste an opportunity to waste an opportunity. what do you make of the political will as both sides prepatient to potentially come to the table? who wants to negotiate, who wants a deal, who wants to move past this? >> right now it's not clear that either side has enough to lose. the cease-fire -- cease-fire agreement is simply designed to stop the shooting. it can't really be the basis of a long-term peace plan between israel and hamas or between israel and the palestinian people. that requires a peace process
12:04 pm
that keeps falling apart and the quote that you brought up was in connection with the constant failures of -- right now there isn't a peace plan on the table. so people -- they're talking about stopping the shooting. there's no peace plan to go back to. there was a peace process four years ago. we can be cynical about how good that was. you can tell the two sides, shot stopping and you have this set of documents to discuss. at this point, there is nothing. all you're saying to both sides is stop shooting. the next question is what happens after that? >> well, so bobby, you have the leaf letting urging the palestinians to move to central locations in gaza. we had netanyahu saying he's open to stronger military action. i'm kind of wondering is the threat of a ground invasion that's been dangled here sort of a reason we're now apparently on the verge of a cease-fire? did that hasten this?
12:05 pm
>> i'm sure that played a part in this. hamas has been bellicose and bell lidge rant, their talk of bring it on. the usual line from the hamas leaders. but i think at least the group that has been negotiating the cease-fire, the egyptian, the qataris, the turks, none want to see the israeli tanks in gaza. they want to see the tanks less than hamas does and they have been sort of the real force, has been pushing the hamas leadership into this cease-fire agreement. if it works, if it works, and it's a big if, if it works, a guy who comes out of this looking golden is actually president morsi of egypt because he's the one who made this happen. >> that's interesting. i was hoping, bobby, you could give us a perspective of sort of what it's like for the average israeli family right now. both in terms of how they view this conflict and how it's
12:06 pm
impacting their life at this moment. i mean on the one hand, you have for the first time ever rockets able to reach major population centers. on the other hand you have the iron dome defense system which seems quite effective. so just take us on the ground, what's it line for people there? >> well, judging by the reporting that my colleagues there have been given and watching it unfold on television, it must be an extremely uncertain and nervous time. and in some small way, the israelis are now living closest to the border with gaza, have felt this for several months. now israelis farther away who thought they were well out of range of hamas' rockets, they beginning to feel what it felt like to live near the border. when the rocket -- when the alarms go off, when you have to duck for cover, what happens if your kids are outside the house. can you go out, is it okay to
12:07 pm
send the kids outside to play well those conversations that they haven't had before, but people living close to the border have always had. now that conversation is taking place near tel aviv and near jerusalem. quite far away from the borders. >> you would expect that the action so far taken by netanyahu had been broadly popular among the israeli population? >> all the opinion polls show there's a lot of popularity for it. a lot of support for ground operations. i think there's a tendency for people to forget that we have seen this movie before, it doesn't end well. >> right. >> if you're living under the fear of rockets, it is tempting to say to your leaders, send in the tanks and let's finish this, but it's the responsibility of your leaders to really say, yeah, we can send in the tanks, we have done that before. that's not what finishes this. we need to follow this up with a political process. >> exactly. to that point that it doesn't end well and that the people in the ground are happy, in israel
12:08 pm
but the rest of the world is saying what are you doing? i wonder does netanyahu's bell coste cost the people more? in the daily beast, leslie gelb said nettanyahu can argue a new israeli offer would be greeted as a sign of weakness, but those rationalizations find less and less resonance worldwide. even among those whose hearts are with israel. so does netanyahu lose something in being so bellicose rather than focusing on another attempt at the peace process? >> he may lose something in his leader, in the eyes of the world opinion, but that doesn't matter so much to him. he has an election two months from now. that matters a lot, and israel doesn't pay a big price for this. what does israel want from the world? it wants support from the united states, from the west for its position. it has that.
12:09 pm
and the obama administration over the last seven or eight days has repeatedly reiterated that position. it wants markets and access like any other country for its economic activity. it still has that. so israel hasn't yet paid a deep economic price. it has paid a price in uncertainty. it has paid a price in the nervousness and the lives that we were just discussing of the people who live under the fear of hamas' rockets. that is a price that it pays. it pays a psychic price. it doesn't pay an economic one. >> the u.s. election just ended and the israeli election is about to happen in january? >> the timing is something -- but people have been commenting about it. you know, there has certainly been an uptick in the number of rockets hamas has been sending over to the israeli side. this is not something that happened in isolation. if netanyahu was itching to pull the trigger, he was given an excuse to do so. >> bobby, real quick before we
12:10 pm
go, secretary of state hillary clinton just landed in israel. what does she hope to accomplish here, what's her job? >> this is really different. the conflict from the ones that have gone before in the region, now the united states has a back seat position. she is there to put the -- to dot the is and cross the ts on the cease-fire agreement that others have brokered. the united states has played a role. let's not understate that. president obama has been on the phone with arab leaders and so has hillary clinton, but the actual deal was moderated or enabled by egypt. and mrs. clinton is there to tell the -- to reassure the israelis that the united states continues to stand behind it. to reassure the palestinians that the united states will sign off on the cease-fire agreement. and then -- so the united states now in some ways is playing the second fiddle which is part of
12:11 pm
the obama strategy. and perhaps makes sense in that region. >> well, thank you for so much for being with us at the table. up next, speaker boehner tightening his grip on the rank and file republicans as the fiscal cliff approaches. we'll have straight talk on the looming deadline. deal or no deal? much more as "the cycle" rolls on. you won't find a "home rule" on every corner, a "stag provisions" down every block, or a "hugh and crye" in every town. these are the small businesses of america, and all across the nation they're getting ready for their day. hundreds of thousands of small businesses are preparing for november 24, a day to open doors, and welcome the millions of customers who will turn out to shop small. small business saturday. visit and get ready. because your day is coming.
12:12 pm
can i still ship a gift in time for christmas? yeah, sure you can. great. where's your gift? uh... whew. [ male announcer ] break from the holiday stress. ship fedex express by december 22nd for christmas delivery.
12:13 pm
anyone have occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas, bloating? yeah. one phillips' colon health probiotic cap each day helps defend against these digestive issues with three strains of good bacteria. approved! [ phillips' lady ] live the regular life. phillips'.
12:14 pm
capitol hill is mourning the death today of former senator warren rudman. the 82-year-old republican is
12:15 pm
best known for writing the budget balancing act in the '80s which aimed to completely end the federal deficit by 1991. he tried to trigger automatic spending cuts. the bill was weakened under presidents reagan and h.w. bush. if it sounds familiar it's because it is the fiscal slope that we're up against was originally designed because of automatic spending cuts that would come into place if the larger deficit deal failed which it did. of course, both sides are vowing to avoid the deadline and key players are working behind the scenes while the rest of washington is gone for the break. we have the chief analyst from moody's analytics. his new book is "paying the price." mark, first to start off with, let's start with kind of the worst case scenario here. let's say there's no deal, we go over the cliff. you know, nobody strikes any deal of any sort. what would happen to the u.s.
12:16 pm
economy? >> it would be brettpretty bad. it would be a recession. debate as to how bad a recession, but at the very least unemployment which is currently just south of 8% would get back into double digits. it would be debilitating. i is so hard to imagine that the -- it's the reason why we'll get a deal. >> i agree. moody's issued a report saying that budget negotiations during the 2013 legislative session will likely determine the direction of the u.s. government's aaa rating and negative outlook that report talked about the debt ceiling. is the primary concern for moody's more the particulars of a deal that would be struck or congressional dysfunction and an inability for the two sides to find common ground in general? >> well, as you know, i'm not part of the rating agency so i have no special insight here. but i'll give you my three cents on what they're saying. i think they want to make sure bottom line that if you look down the road five or ten years
12:17 pm
from now that the nation's debt to gdp ratio, that's the collective debt load, is falling, declining. that we make changes to the -- to tax revenue spending cuts that we get to this declining debt to gdp ratio. if we can do that and it's credible, then i think our rating is fine. if you read what they're saying. and if we are unable to do that, then our rating is in jeopardy. >> mark, i'm glad that you said that you think there's going to be a deal, because i think it's a bit of fear mongering -- not saying anything about you, krystal, to talk about the scenario if we don't get a deal done, i think we'll get a deal done, and wall street is confident that we'll get a deal done. we have seen stocks moving upward in the last couple of days. the consequences are too dire if we don't get a deal done as you laid out. we will get a deal done, right? >> yeah, but, you know -- yes,
12:18 pm
we will get a deal. but we need a good deal. meaning we need a deal that scales back the fiscal cliff so that we don't have these kinds of tax increases, we don't have these kind of spending cuts. the economy can digest some tax increases and spending cuts, but not what we have currently legislated. the deal has to include an increase in the debt ceiling and harkening back to our rating, we need to come up with a credible plan of deficit reduction over the next decade. that results in deficits in the future that are debt to gdp ratio begins to decline. we'll get a deal, but we need a good deal. if we get the good deal then we'll have a good economy. the only thing separating our economy from much stronger growth, more jobs and declining unemployment is this budget deal. so, you know, that's all we need to do. it's hard to do politically. but economically, that's, you know, we have to do it. >> but, you know, mark, a key in
12:19 pm
determining what the deal is going to look like is how we approach whether it's through the media or the political class in general is how broaapproach looming deal. to get the republicans to give in for the tax rates for the wealthy for those over $250,000, if they get beyond january 1st they have the leverage to force that, maybe more leverage than they have now. a lot of pressure from republicans and i would say from the third-way types that are interested in making radical changes to the social safety net, a lot of pressure there to say we can't ever go past january 1st, it would be a disaster. but i think i saw an interview with you in "the washington post" where you said, no, it's okay to go past january 1st. is that fair to say? >> yeah -- no, obviously, this would be very good to get done before january 1st. i think it's still possible to get done, because you just laid out the script. i mean, everyone knows it. so -- getting it done before january 1st. if we don't and we actually get
12:20 pm
to the beginning of next year and we don't have a deal, then it's not the end of the world. it's a fiscal slope. it's not a wile e. coyote moment. don't change your spending because we think the deal will come, then the economy will weaken day by day and then investors will lose faith and confidence. it is better to go into next year, to get that better deal. we need to come out of this with a good deal. it's not worth it going down this path and coming away with something that doesn't address the fiscal cliff. doesn't raise the treasury debt ceiling and does not result in fiscal sustainability. if we don't do it now, i fear we won't do it. so we have to do it right now. and if it takes going into next year, then so be it. >> mark, so that steve doesn't totally lose his cool, i want to make sure, he gets attribution
12:21 pm
for fiscal slope. for like a month now. >> it's steve kornackiism. >> before we go -- >> i'll give you the credit, steve. >> thank you. >> before we go, quickly, you know, i want to get festive for a moment. we have a holiday coming up. that means black friday shopping deals and then of course christmas. a lot of people think about consumer spending and charitable giving around this time of the year. what kind of impact will the fiscal cliff have on that? >> well, it will have an impact. but interesting enough, consumers seem to be navigating through this as well. they haven't cut back on the hiring. the job market is holding firm. unemployment is still trending lower. so i think christmas it won't be great. i don't see how it can be great, but it will be okay. i think we'll be fine. >> all right, mark zandi, thank you. >> thank you. president obama will join 50 million americans on the road this holiday season, but he's not talking turkey. lame duck is on his menu. we'll explain next in "the spin."
12:22 pm
eat good fats.
12:23 pm
avoid bad. don't go over 2000... 1200 calories a day. carbs are bad. carbs are good. the story keeps changing. so i'm not listening... to anyone but myself. i know better nutrition when i see it: great grains. great grains cereal starts whole and stays whole. see the seam? more processed flakes look nothing like natural grains. you can't argue with nutrition you can see. great grains. search great grains and see for yourself.
12:24 pm
for multi grain flakes that are an excellent source of fiber try great grains banana nut crunch and cranberry almond crunch.
12:25 pm
even before last night's results, i felt that the work that i had done in running for office had come full circle. because what you guys have done means that the work that i'm doing is important. i'm really proud of that. i'm really proud of all of you. >> that was an emotional president obama thanking his staff and volunteers after his win two weeks ago. you know what? he should be crying because that's how good his ground game was. in fact, it was so effective machine isn't going anywhere. according to the huffington post sam stein, the president plans on using it to apply pressure on
12:26 pm
the lame duck congress. so like the flying circuses of the '20s and baseball in the '40s, the president is going barnstorming, tank his message to the people. we're doing the same as we put this through the spin cycle. i guess my take on this would be this is -- if it ain't broke, don't fix it. i think there was a pretty abrupt and significant change in how obama approached governing that took place in the summer of 2011. it was right after the debt ceiling ordeal when he had tried really hard to strike this grand bargain with john boehner and the republicans and it blew up in his face and it resulted in the lowest approval rating of obama's presidency at that point. he never more like a one-term president than if august of 2011. he decided he wouldn't be able to negotiate just inside washington with the republicans to get a deal. he had to go out and campaign on his ideas and win an election and get some kind of a mandate. i know we hate that term, but some kind of a mandate and
12:27 pm
specifically on the issue of raising taxes on income over $250,000. i think that is the single most important thing in terms of going forward that he got out of this election was that he could now say and he's been saying, hey, i went and i told the country this is exactly what i want to do on taxes. this is the difference between me and the republicans on taxes. he can say the country sides with me. pretty -- pretty strongly. i think he's basically going out there and trying to reinforce that message and he can take that -- he can take that to the people and he said i campaigned on it, i won out. this is the test. are republicans going to hear that message or not? my only question as we get closer to the general 1st deadline if some kind of a deal starts to take shape, the issue there isentitlements. if he starts to cut a deal there with the republicans that may be friendly to republican terms, i do wonder if he can sell that to the base. that's a departure from his
12:28 pm
strategy of a last year and half. but the basic idea of going out there and campaigning on this right here, i don't see why he'd stop right now. >> you know, you can't argue his ground game was really good, steve. i think that what he and jim mussina want to do is make sure it stays intact for next democratic election, whether in two or four years. maybe you could possibly read into this that he's not as confident that he has the kind of leverage he needs with the gop and he has to go out and sell this some more. i also think that last point that you made, steve, was right. that he is going to be facing a lot of pressure if he's not already from liberal activist groups. folks like trumka and labor groups who don't want him to cave on the entitlements and benefits when he's talking to the gop. if he gets to them first and says, don't pressure me, let's both pressure the gop together, it's almost kind of circumventing that scenario and saying, let's work together toward a common enemy. it's not me, you don't have to
12:29 pm
pressure me. pressure the gop. >> yeah. s.e., i read the tea leaves entirely different. >> that never happens. >> and the battle is won or lost by determining on what playing field the battle will be fought. if obama makes this a national fight rather than leaves it in washington, he has more leverage. this is him using -- >> i thought he had all the leverage he needed. >> he had all the leverage he needed and will make it even more so. >> okay. >> using the bully pulpit and his charisma and his popularity and the popularity on taxing the wealthy even more. and getting out there and bringing the nation into this discussion with him. you know, look, he has the leverage. his biggest regret he said in the campaign, but he was right, not messaging properly what he wanted to do. this is what he's talking about. now he'll start to do it. look, the only way he'll lose this is to make it a d.c. fight and get in the d.c. muck. while he makes it nationwide and uses his charisma, uses his leverage in the bully pulpit he
12:30 pm
can't lose. >> going back to what steve was saying, those of us behind the president, progressives, when he went to kansas and started to take the message to the people we said hallelujah. finally this what he should have been doing from the beginning. it has been effective. he does have a lot of leverage here, but it never hurts to have the people behind you as well. in 2008, they originally tried to morph obama for america into organizing for america. and it never really worked well. people really never got engaged in it. to me it's very encouraging and a it reminds me of my favorite quote ever from the much maligned community organizer saul alinsky who says action comes from keeping the heat on. no politician can sit on a hot issue if you make it hot enough. i think we have seen examples this year. early in 2012 this wasn't a policy issue, but komen for the cure had decided to end their long-standing relationship with
12:31 pm
planned parenthood. people were upset about it and komen had to change that position. from virginia, bob mcdonnell controlled the house delegates there and they could pass any legislation that they wanted. they introduced this bill to mandate transvaginal probes for women seeking an abortion. people got upset and even though the republicans held the political power they had to go back on that and the personhood bill. because ultimately the most powerful force in our democracy still today is the power of the people and that is an amazing thing. >> yeah. i think the strategy here is very much about just keeping the pressure on. it's already there. it makes sense to me. before we go, i want to take sort of a point of personal privilege here. you might be wondering why am i in hartford, connecticut, today, it's not only because of the whalers. my grandmother passed away.
12:32 pm
lived in water bury, connecticut. the story is a story of america for the last century. it was a factory town. sort of the brass capital of the united states. it's where the working class and middle class was built in the middle of the 20th century. water bury is a story that the united states i think, and i think my grandmother's life is the story of water bury. she was born into a family that didn't even speak english. her mother during prohibition might have been involved in a little bootlegging. and my grandmother willed her way into nursing school and through nursing school. she raised five kids. she was a nurse for 30 years and in the city of water bury she unionized her hospital at a time when, you know, that was brand new. the first hospital in connecticut that was unionized. my grandmother did that. she just had an extraordinary life. my favorite story also was a couple of years ago she even --
12:33 pm
a big football fan. she put a bet on the super bowl when she was 90 years old. i love my grandmother. i'm going to miss her. and stella, a good life. that's that. i'll be back in new york tomorrow. lots more ahead on "the cycle" this tuesday. stay with us. [ male announcer ] if you suffer from heartburn 2 or more days a week,
12:34 pm
why use temporary treatments when you can prevent the acid that's causing it with prevacid24hr. with one pill prevacid24hr works at the source to prevent the acid that causes frequent heartburn all day and all night. and with new prevacid24hr perks, you can earn rewards from dinner deals to music downloads for purchasing prevacid24hr. prevent acid all day and all night for 24 hours with prevacid24hr. i am probably going to the gas station about once a month. last time i was at a gas station was about...i would say... two months ago. i very rarely put gas in my chevy volt. i go to the gas station such a small amount that i forget how to put gas in my car. [ male announcer ] and it's not just these owners giving the volt high praise. volt received the j.d. power and associates appeal award two years in a row. ♪
12:35 pm
12:36 pm
when you take a closer look... the best schools in the world... see they all have something very interesting in common. they have teachers... ...with a deeper knowledge of their subjects. as a result, their students achieve at a higher level. let's develop more stars in education. let's invest in our teachers... they can inspire our students. let's solve this. americans like their guns, okay, we really like our guns. in fact, there are close to 300 million of them out there, nearly one in five of us own one or more than one. to put that in perspective, we outnumber all other countries. india, the only one close at 46 million if you want to call that close. but for all the firearms out
12:37 pm
there, there's also fiery debate about gun rights and when recent tragedies like tucson or aurora, colorado, happen, both sides dig in even deeper. how do we reconcile the second amendment with the safety of innocent americans? today we have got a self-described liberal who argues simply disarming america is not the answer. craig whitney is a correspondent, and author of "living with guns, a liberal case for the second amendment." welcome, craig. >> thank you. >> so you outline a number of great arguments familiar to most gun owners like myself about the philosophical case for the second amendment. tell the skeptics out there on the other side why we need to learn to live with guns? >> because we as americans have had guns and had the individual right to keep and use firearms ever since the earliest colonial days. that's the right that was recognized by the second amendment. not created by, but recognized by it. it still exists today. the reason why they created --
12:38 pm
why they wrote the second amendment maybe had to do with keeping the ability of states to preserve their militias when there was a strong federal government that might turn tyrannical. that doesn't alter the fact that the right is always there. there's also a right to live in safety from gun violence and those two rights have to be reconciled. >> yeah. >> we're not doing a very good job of talking with each other about how to do it. >> well, we're not. you know, i don't want to beat anyone up here, but some folks in the gun control argument don't really come up with feasible solutions because they don't fundamentally understand how gun violence works in a lot of cases. to give you an example, this microstamping debate. the idea here is that you microstamp, imprint a number on the inside of a shell casing. if a gun is use toss perpetrate the crime, you can trace it back to the gun. that only works if you have a law-abiding criminal who registers his handgun. gives an actual home address and
12:39 pm
a real name and a driver's license and is sitting at his house waiting to be arrested. that's generally not how criminals act. so what kinds of real solutions can we get to with gun control advocates that can actually address gun crime in a meaningful way and not punish law-abiding gun owners? >> one way is to tighten the loophole that exists now where if you buy a gun from a gun dealer, your name has to go through a federal background check system. if you're a drug addict or a criminal or something, you can't buy one. but you can buy guns from private sellers. >> agagun shows. >> not just gun shows but any private sale. that's 40% of all sales that's a lot of guns. the other is to crack down on strawmen. straw purchases. people who buy guns for other people who don't qualify.
12:40 pm
often they're criminals. the police like the idea of microstamping. yes, you can trace it back to the straw person who bought it, but that gets them a little closer to finding the criminal -- >> if they're lucky. >> craig, you talk about living in safety in a world filled with guns. some of those stats on the number of guns in america is quite appalling to me. but guns don't make us safer. if you have a gun in the home it's 43 times more likely to kill a family member than intruder. there are more children killed by guns in the last 25 years than the number of soldiers killed in all wars in the last 50 years. there have been many years in which there are more kids killed in america by handguns than cops killed. they maybe us feel safer. but they do not make us safer. the proliferation of guns in america does not make us safer. so you have the constitution sitting there, but that's sort of the thing that gun rights lovers always hold dear. can you defend the right to have guns without relying on the second amendment? without going to the second amendment, can you answer the
12:41 pm
sentence, guns are good because -- >> because guns don't kill people, people do. that's the quote -- >> oh, come on. >> i would argue that -- agree with you that, yes, having a gun per se does not bring you safety. if you don't know how to use a gun properly, if you don't have it right next to your bedside when the robber comes in with a gun to shoot you with, it's not going to do you any good. a lot of people argued after the aurora massacre, for instance, it would be good if a lot of people in the movie house were carrying guns, it would have been good. i don't agree with that because they could have shot each other or have a deadly cross fire. the safety brought by owning a gun is largely illusory, yes. but there are cases that somebody specifically threatens you, i'm going to kill you, and
12:42 pm
you -- if you live in new york here, you went to the police and said he told me that, some of the cops would say, get yourself a gun. then you went down to one police plaza to apply for a -- to apply for a license they'd laugh at you. when you get a driver's license nobody says you don't need a car, do they? >> right. >> well, i think that a lot of times people like me, i'm sympathetic to the arguments you're making. i think people should have a right -- law-abiding citizens should have a right to own a gun, but nra, gun owners of america, they go so far as to oppose any restriction on owning anything in any number at any time. you know, even reasonable things like trying to crack down on trafficking by limiting the number of gun purchases or limiting magazine capacity to lessen the tragedy in a mass shooting like aurora. wouldn't they do themselves more of a service if they took a bit more of a reasonable position on
12:43 pm
this? >> yes, and what can people on the other side do to get them to do that? they probably have to wait for new leadership in the nra for one thing. but if it were clear to gun owners in america that people who favor gun control don't aim to take everybody's guns away from them, that's not the object. >> right. >> it's to find -- >> we tried to make that clear. >> we're trying to make it clear here. but i think the nra lives off the impression that it -- >> it's also a slippery slope. every time there's an encroachment on your freedom to be a law-abiding citizen and to carry your gun legally that this is just going to go another step further and another step further. gun owners are not stupid. we have been around for a long time and we know what this fight looks like. >> let's let steve get in. >> you know, you talk about the slippery slope there, you take one step and let's just put it in perspective where we are on this. in 1994, the congress and the president of the united states
12:44 pm
banned semiautomatic assault weapons. that was where we were on gun control. we're talking about, you know, banning handguns or anything like that. nothing about hunting. just semiautomatic assault weapons. and this ban expired. congress let that die in 2004 and there's been no action on that for a decade since then there's a tradition of gun control in this country and all that. but what is the case for not banning assault weapons? >> well, assault weapons don't figure importantly in most violent crime. they're spectacularly present in these mass massacres that we have had. and i gather also in confrontations with law enforcement sometimes. but when -- during the time of the ban on the so-called assault weapons, violent crime didn't go down that much and they had grandfathered the assault weapons that had been bought before 1994. if they reimpose it, president obama did say in the last presidential debate with mitt romney what would happen?
12:45 pm
>> we'll have to wait and see. craig whitney, thank you for stopping by. straight ahead, has the obama presidency been good for black people? we've got a guest who says not really. so uh this is my friend frank and his, uh, retirement plan. one golden crown. come on frank how long have we known each other? go to e-trade. they got killer tools man. they'll help you nail a retirement plan that's fierce. two golden crowns. you realize the odds of winning are the same as being mauled by a polar bear and a regular bear in the same day? frank! oh wow, you didn't win? i wanna show you something... it's my shocked face. [ gasps ] ♪ [ male announcer ] get a retirement plan that works at e-trade. try this... bayer? this isn't just a headache. trust me, this is new bayer migraine. [ male announcer ] it's the power of aspirin plus more in a triple action formula to relieve your tough migraines. new bayer migraine formula.
12:46 pm
12:47 pm
a body at rest tends to stay at rest... while a body in motion tends to stay in motion. staying active can actually ease arthritis symptoms. but if you have arthritis, staying active can be difficult. prescription celebrex can help relieve arthritis pain so your body can stay in motion. because just one 200mg celebrex a day can provide 24 hour relief for many with arthritis pain and inflammation. plus, in clinical studies, celebrex is proven to improve daily physical function so moving is easier. celebrex can be taken with or without food. and it's not a narcotic. you and your doctor should balance the benefits with the risks. all prescription nsaids, like celebrex, ibuprofen, naproxen, and meloxicam have the same cardiovascular warning. they all may increase the chance
12:48 pm
of heart attack or stroke, which can lead to death. this chance increases if you have heart disease or risk factors such as high blood pressure or when nsaids are taken for long periods. nsaids, including celebrex, increase the chance of serious skin or allergic reactions or stomach and intestine problems, such as bleeding and ulcers, which can occur without warning and may cause death. patients also taking aspirin and the elderly are at increased risk for stomach bleeding and ulcers. do not take celebrex if you've had an asthma attack, hives, or other allergies to aspirin, nsaids or sulfonamides. get help right away if you have swelling of the face or throat, or trouble breathing. tell your doctor your medical history and find an arthritis treatment for you. visit and ask your doctor about celebrex. for a body in motion. somebody black should run, nothing to lose, it would be fun, man. can't get no worse than it's been in the last hundred years. everybody is afraid to run
12:49 pm
because they know even though it's 1982 it's still a risky business to be the first black president. you know, you have to give speeches like this. my fellow americans, as the president -- we the people must get together and join hands. we must be -- i'm not too happy about this. >> somebody black did run, and won twice. we're two weeks removed from barack obama being re-elected and we have broken the race down from every angle. but black angles made up 13% of the electorate and went for president obama 93%. his victory was our victory, but is obama's presidency good for black people? sure there's a powerful spiritual self-esteem boost, but what about black unemployment that is double white unemployment? and it was the culmination of dr. king's dream, but in some
12:50 pm
years the last four years have been a disappointment for black people. joining us is frederick harris from columbia university and the author of of the ticket, barack obama and the rise and decline of black politics." how are you? >> i'm doing great. >> we have a leadership dearth in the black community. you know that, we all know that. i think this in your argument you're asking barack to fill some of that dearth. >> african-americans have to pressure the president like other key constituencies in the democratic party, like activists in the gay and lesbian community, latino activists around immigration. if you don't ask for anything, black leaders have done a wonderful job in registering voters and getting them out, but the question is where is the ask? what do they get in return?
12:51 pm
where's the reciprocity. i say it's a two-way proposition but the president did make some promises. >> cornell west and other folks like him have been a little critical of the president for his failure to address poverty. i'll read one quote. he says it's very sad, i'm glad there was no right wing takeover but we end up with a republican, a rockefeller republican in bla black face with barack obama so our struggle with regard to poverty intensifientensifies. >> unfortunately, i don't want to -- for many people who are critical of the president to get engaged in personal attacks because there's a lot based on policy and politics that one could be critical of the president, and so to get back to the previous question actually, there was some promises that the president did make as a candidate in 2007. at a speech at howard university, he props epromised
12:52 pm
federal level racial profiling act to the students and faculty there. he promised loan forgiveness to students who decided to become public defenders. on the other side of the lenler, where is president barack obama been with fulfilling these promises he made. juneau, you can't tell the story of the obama presidency without talking about obstruction, and he couldn't have really accomplished any of those things the way the republicans were dragging him down. >> yeah, but why didn't the obstruction work for other key groups. they didn't get the dream act but they got executive action on stopping deportation of young people. you need pressure. you need to pressure political activists to do something. and so in that regard i still don't think the president has come through as much as he should and african m.a.s.h.s as -- whas
12:53 pm
we look at issue that is affect him haven't pressured him on those ends. >> you know, toure says something earlier i want to build on. this idea, this tension between obama being a politician who happens to be black more than a black politician. and i think that gets to something in the system that's a lot broader and i have seen covering politics at the state level where it's striking to me, the how many times, the congress is the feeder system for statewide office in this country, for senate, for governor, for high-profile statewide office that is become the springboard to national office. 49 senators right now served in the house originally, but there has never been a black congressman who has ever been elected to the senate, never been a black congressman ever elected to a governorship. i have seen this at the state level. what happens is so many of these black representatives come from minority/majority districts. this is a problem in the democratic party. there's almost a stigma where they say these are politicians who we can't market statewide.
12:54 pm
the districts are too poor, too liberal, too black. and it steams to eems to me tha inhibited the growth of black -- we have a black president but we don't have many black senators or black governors right now. >> that's absolutely right. i wish we had a little more time to talk about this. you know black politicians cannot get elected as em sary. coming up, s.e. will teach some manners, manners she sometimes brings to the table. choose the d your mom trusted for you. children's tylenol, the #1 brand of pain and fever relief recommended by pediatricians and used by moms decade after decade. i'd like to thank eating right, whole grain, multigrain cheerios! mom, are those my jeans? [ female announcer ] people who choose more whole grain tend to weigh less than those who don't. multigrain cheerios tend to weigh less than those who don't. is bigger than we think ... sometimelike the flu.fer from
12:55 pm
with aches, fever and chills- the flu's a really big deal. so why treat it like it's a little cold? there's something that works differently than over-the-counter remedies. prescription tamiflu attacks the flu virus at its source. so don't wait. call your doctor right away. tamiflu is prescription medicine for treating the flu in adults and children one year and older whose flu symptoms started within the last two days. before taking tamiflu tell your doctor if you're pregnant, nursing. have serious health conditions, or take other medicines. if you develop an allergic reaction, a severe rash, or signs of unusual behavior, stop taking tamiflu and call your doctor immediately. children and adolescents in particular may be at an increased risk of seizures, confusion or abnormal behavior. the most common side effects are mild to moderate nausea and vomiting. the flu comes on fast, so ask your doctor about tamiflu. prescription for flu.
12:56 pm
some people put everything intotheir name on the door, and their heart into their community. small business saturday is a day to show our support. a day to shop at stores owned by our friends and neighbors. and do our part for the businesses that do so much for us. on november 24th, let's get out and shop small.
12:57 pm
i think as footage proves, i was unreserved in expressing my disappointment that president
12:58 pm
obama won re-election. i have been a stalwart defender of the conservative principles he's opposed and i've been critical of his failures but i'm also not a petulant child. that's one way i describe the secessionist movement. with all due respect to my conservatives in arms who are choosing to deal with this loss by threatening to leave the country and take a state or two with them, may i just say go to the corner, you need a time-out. on the morning after the election i woke up, ate breakfast, put clothes on, and got back to the business of living my life. yes, it's under a president whose policies make my blood boil, but i don't think moving to canada would solve much of anything unless, of course, it means i automatic get stock in canadian bacon. no? that's not how to works up there? then i'm definitely out. nor do i think attempting to break up our great union into pieces so i need a passport to go to wyoming is particularly productive. there will be another election in four years. even though many of these policies will be hard if not impossible to undo, i'd rather
12:59 pm
be an american than a new yorkian because that sounds weird. ron paul has weighed in on the matter writing secession is a deeply american principle. that is what our revolutionary war was all about. well, that's true, but it was also about committing to the cause of democracy, which if implemented correctly would call into question our values from time to time and would require us to disagree once in a while. we didn't say we the people of the united states in order to form a more perfect union until we don't like it anymore at which point we'll take our toys and go home. this thing was built to last. we were in it for the long haul. we knew we'd have to work for it. and that's what i'm going to keep doing because when things don't go our way, we don't pout in the corner like children. we put on our big boy pants and get down to business, and now more than ever we need to commit to our great country. we need to commit to each other and find ways to disagree productively. this stunt is immature and unpatriotic and i resent it. i mean, if i can come in here

The Cycle
MSNBC November 20, 2012 12:00pm-1:00pm PST

News/Business. Politics, the economy, media, sports and any other issues that grab people's attention. New.

TOPIC FREQUENCY Israel 13, Steve 5, Washington 4, Barack Obama 3, Obama 3, Bobby 3, Phillips 2, Craig Whitney 2, Komen 2, Clinton 2, U.n. 2, Moody 's 2, Tamiflu 2, Martin Fletcher 2, Netanyahu 2, New York 2, Connecticut 2, Jerusalem 2, S.e. 2, Nra 1
Network MSNBC
Duration 01:00:00
Scanned in San Francisco, CA, USA
Source Comcast Cable
Tuner Virtual Ch. 787 (MSNBC HD)
Video Codec mpeg2video
Audio Cocec ac3
Pixel width 1920
Pixel height 1080
Sponsor Internet Archive
Audio/Visual sound, color

disc Borrow a DVD of this show
info Stream Only
Uploaded by
TV Archive
on 11/20/2012